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Autor: Betreff: Neu auf Deutschland bcgpete Newbie Beiträge: 2 Registriert: 9.7.2014 Status: Offline erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 11:15   Hallo! My wife and I recently were stationed in Baumholder. I have heard different things about homebrewing in Germany, specifically about having to register with your local customs office and report to them every time you brew. As an American, is this necessary for me? Is it even necessary at all? I do not plan on selling any of the beer. However, I generally brew over 200L a year. Also, I brew all-grain, and generally buy my grains in bulk. This usually makes ordering online out of the question because of shipping costs. Are there any stores in this area that I can go to? I've heard that Weyermann has a "Fan Shop" where they sell grains to homebrewers, but I don't want to make the long trip out there if this isn't true. Danke und Prost! Kenneth flying Moderator Beiträge: 9088 Registriert: 14.8.2008 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 11:32   Hi Kenneth, willkommen in Deutschland. Baumholder kenne ich. Da war ich mal in meiner Bundeswehrzeit. Ist aber schon über 20 Jahre her. Dein Landsmann Daniel Laziure hat einen Shop für Braumaterialien in Schaafheim. Ist ungefähr 2 h mit dem Auto von Dir. http://amihopfen.com/ Die Zollmeldung gilt vermutlich für Dich auch? Eine einfache Meldung per email 1 x im Jahr genügt aber. Wende Dich aber lieber an unseren Experten in solchen Frage, den User Brauwolf! Der ist auch häufig bei Daniel zu finden, glaube ich. m.f.g René [Editiert am 27.7.2014 um 11:33 von flying] ____________________ "Fermentation und Zivilisation sind untrennbar verbunden" (John Ciardi) Antwort 1 Berliner Moderator Beiträge: 4024 Registriert: 7.4.2006 Status: Offline erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 11:34   Hi Kenneth, welcome to Germany and the hobbybrauer forum! Weyermann doesn't sell to homebrewers anymore, but there are other maltsters in the Franken area which do. You can check it on my "Brauereikarte". By Law you have to register at your local customs administration regardless if you sell it or not. It is different from location to location if you have to register each brew or only once yearly. You can brew 200 Liters tax-free when you brew only for your own consumption. Above this you have to pay taxes. [Editiert am 27.7.2014 um 11:37 von Berliner] ____________________ Gruß vom Berliner Antwort 2 WPSBerlin Newbie Beiträge: 3 Registriert: 22.3.2012 Status: Offline erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 11:57   Hi. According to German law, yes, you do have to register with the local customs office -- strictly interpreted, you have to register "in general" and then register in advance for each batch you brew, giving location, quantity, °Plato, etc. Especially as a foreigner here (even though I have my "green card"), I've always figured it's best to not ignore that kind of law. However, it gets interpreted differently by the local customs offices. Here in Berlin, they just changed it so that I only have to send in an e-mail before the first batch each year, telling them how much I plan to brew for the year. No more individual registrations for each batch. Much more sensible. There is a beer tax based on strength and volume for anything over 200 L. In no case is it terribly high, but it's reduced for non-commercial brewers. I can't believe that even if you declare 200 L over the tax-free limit that the income they would receive would even pay for the processing costs. I don't come near the 200 L limit. From what I've heard, some of those who exceed it declare, some don't. The 200 L limit also is per household, not per adult in a household (which I find rather absurd...). I don't know how rigidly the customs office ("Zollamt") follows up on this law for hobby brewers. I've always suspected that if they wanted to they could track orders from the sellers to see who is buying a bunch of malt, for example -- but I don't know if that would even be legal here (unless they had a specific suspicion about someone...) Stores that sell grain? I'm not sure about R-P, but there's nothing like that in Berlin -- everything has to be purchased online. A craft brewery in my neighborhood apparently sold malt to individuals at some point in the past, but they stopped doing so because of the paperwork with the Zollamt that that involved. I just checked with one of the online shops -- hobbybrauerversand.de (they also have an English version of their shop--just an example, no commercial interest on my part.). They sell 25 kg sacks of malt, depending on the style, about €28–32, and it looks like their shipping is around €6 per shipment. I did a sample order of 2x25kg and it still came out to €5.99 shipping -- total. With the price of gas here, I suspect that that deal is cheaper than driving a couple towns over to pick up your supplies from a store. So, enjoy your time here. Bill Antwort 3 WPSBerlin Newbie Beiträge: 3 Registriert: 22.3.2012 Status: Offline erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 12:16   Hi, I'm back, since I noticed that several others replied as I wrote my answer. As you can see, each "Zollamt" does things differently, so you'll have to find out what the Zollamt that is reponsible for Baumholder requires. I just checked out Daniel Laziure's amihopfen.de -- he's really expanded his selection since I ordered hops from him a while back. Back then, he wanted to focus only on hop varieties, but now he's added malts, yeasts, cleansers plus some other things that aren't always available from the big German shops that are online. I don't think you'll find the varieties of hops that he offers anywhere else. Plus, at least when I last ordered from here, he was extremely helpful. Antwort 4 Birk Posting Freak Beiträge: 3313 Registriert: 19.10.2011 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 12:32   Hi bcgpete Please email me with your specific questions and the answer below, I can get you setup and with what I know or don't know there are plently of people here to get you going EDIT: Partly deleted for information that may not be accurate [Editiert am 27.7.2014 um 13:34 von Birk] ____________________ http://www.AmiHopfen.com Hopfen vom Ami, aus Amiland und anderswo Antwort 5 Birk Posting Freak Beiträge: 3313 Registriert: 19.10.2011 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 12:54   EDIT: deleted for information that may not be accurate [Editiert am 27.7.2014 um 13:34 von Birk] ____________________ http://www.AmiHopfen.com Hopfen vom Ami, aus Amiland und anderswo Antwort 6 Birk Posting Freak Beiträge: 3313 Registriert: 19.10.2011 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 13:21   I stand corrected, pending an official answer it is my opinion that you must register no matter what your status is. ____________________ http://www.AmiHopfen.com Hopfen vom Ami, aus Amiland und anderswo Antwort 7 bcgpete Newbie Beiträge: 2 Registriert: 9.7.2014 Status: Offline erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 13:24   Thank you everyone for all of the replies! It seems there are a lot more homebrewers in Germany than I expected. I'll be looking into all of these sites, and will hopefully be brewing as soon as we get settled in! Kenneth Antwort 8 Birk Posting Freak Beiträge: 3313 Registriert: 19.10.2011 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 13:32   Hat jemand etwas anders zum sagen über die Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA) oder wissen etwas über was Mann machen muss. Ich denke einfach eine Zoll Anmeldung ist am besten und alle die gleiche Regal wir haben, danach kann nichts passieren. ____________________ http://www.AmiHopfen.com Hopfen vom Ami, aus Amiland und anderswo Antwort 9 rolfonso Senior Member Beiträge: 277 Registriert: 1.7.2012 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 15:51   It depends on the locatio you will brew. If you will brew at home you must register at the "Hauptzollamt", if you'll brew in the Baumholder baracks you are is on US territory. Kenneth, register yourself at your responsible "Hauptzollamt". Here http://www.zoll.de/EN/Home/home_node.html you'll find all details you need to know. Cheers, rolfonso Antwort 10 Schlupfer Posting Freak Beiträge: 1002 Registriert: 27.7.2011 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 16:07   Hi, Daniel hat absolut Recht - einfach das Brauen beim Zoll anmelden. Es ist nur eine Email. Für Baumholder ist das HZA Koblenz zuständig. Sende eine Email das Du als Hobbybrauer zu Hause Bier machst an " poststelle at hzako.bfinv.de " Es reicht eine Email pro Jahr. Nach der Email kannst Du sofort brauen. Erwarte keine Antwort vom Zoll. Let us know if you need an example how to phrase the mail in German language. Michael ____________________ Don´t worry - Brew happy Antwort 11 Ladeberger Posting Freak Beiträge: 1946 Registriert: 20.11.2012 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 16:31   Zitat von rolfonso, am 27.7.2014 um 15:51 if you'll brew in the Baumholder baracks you are is on US territory. That's wrong, the U.S. military bases run under German regulations and are certainly not extraterritorial. The applicable law is defined by the "NATO-Truppenstatut" and the "Zusatzabkommen zum NATO-Truppenstatut". I highly doubt you'll find a tax break on brewing... Gruß Andy Antwort 12 Brauwolf Posting Freak Beiträge: 3548 Registriert: 26.2.2012 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 16:34   Ich habe Kenneth zu diesem Thema gerade eine PM geschickt. Was er darf und muss hängt im Wesentlichen von seinem Status ab und ist im NATO-Truppenstatut in der Fassung vom 18. März 1993 und Zusatzvereinbarungen geregelt. Vielleicht sollten wir hier auf gutgemeinte Ratschläge verzichten, die Situation ist eine völlig andere als für deutsche "Normal"bürger. Cheers, Ruthard ____________________ Mein Blog: Brew24.com Antwort 13 Birk Posting Freak Beiträge: 3313 Registriert: 19.10.2011 Status: Offline Geschlecht: erstellt am: 27.7.2014 um 16:38   This question of the status of a brewer who would like to brew in Germany is being routed to a lawyer in the military system. I don't think the German zollamt will know any different or do any research to tell you otherwise. I however think it is highly unlikely that anyone on German land will get any tax break or not have to report or register with the tax office. Only one place that I think this rule would not apply is at the Cosulate in Frankfurt or Berlin. Until we get that answer please wait for comments. [Editiert am 27.7.2014 um 16:39 von Birk] ____________________ http://www.AmiHopfen.com Hopfen vom Ami, aus Amiland und anderswo Antwort 14